Legislature(1995 - 1996)

03/17/1995 02:59 PM Senate JUD

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
 SJUD - 3/17/95                                                                
          SB  26 OFFENSES BY JUVENILE USING FIREARMS                          
                                                                              
 SENATOR DONLEY, sponsor of SB 26, testified before the committee.             
 He stated in Anchorage there is a clear problem with juveniles                
 bringing guns to school.  Progress has been made over the past                
 eight years in decreasing the problem, but police are concerned               
 about the fact that the penalty is not a significant deterrent as             
 offenders are treated through the juvenile process.  SB 26 is aimed           
 at second-time firearm violation offenders, and would require them            
 to be waived into adult court.                                                
                                                                               
 Number 340                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR DONLEY stated there are a lot of suspensions occurring in             
 Anchorage.  He noted there is a new federal mandate relating to               
 firearm offenders in educational facilities.  He explained SB 26              
 deals with all firearms violations, not only those at educational             
 facilities.  He added that six years ago a law was passed which               
 made it illegal to have a firearm on school property, but because             
 the offenders are juveniles, the penalties are ineffective.  Even             
 when students were expelled, they were allowed to re-enroll in                
 another school in the same school district after a certain period             
 of time.                                                                      
                                                                               
 Number 376                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR ADAMS asked what the penalty would be for the second                  
 offense.  SENATOR DONLEY clarified it would depend on the crime.              
 The range would be huge, and would include a felony for armed                 
 robbery.  SENATOR TAYLOR asked what the penalty would be for                  
 bringing a gun to school for the second time.  SENATOR DONLEY                 
 replied it is a misdemeanor.                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 390                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR GREEN noted that in conversations with judges, they have              
 expressed great frustration that serious offenses by juveniles                
 remain sealed.  SENATOR DONLEY replied for a second offense, the              
 individual would be tried as an adult in court which is open to the           
 public.                                                                       
                                                                               
 Number 402                                                                    
                                                                               
 MARGOT KNUTH, assistant attorney general with the Department of               
 Law, testified.  She noted Governor Knowles introduced HB 206 which           
 relates to juveniles and guns, and several other measures are                 
 pending before the legislature on the same subject.  She stated the           
 administration cannot support SB 26, which has an automatic waiver            
 for juveniles age 14 and over for a second weapon offense, for                
 several reasons.  She stated the bill goes too far, too early.  HB
 206, the Governor's bill, expands the use it, lose it concept, so             
 that driving privileges would be revoked for offenses.  According             
 to Shirley Warner of the Anchorage Police Department, the use it,             
 lose it approach has done more to curb alcohol use among juveniles,           
 and the same holds true in Juneau.                                            
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH continued.  Part of the problem is the dynamics of                  
 offenders.  It isn't the severity of the sanction that deters                 
 people from committing crimes, but how much they believe they are             
 going to get caught, and whether the imposition of sanctions seems            
 realistic to them.  Juveniles have difficulty believing they will             
 end up in jail for certain offenses, but they do believe they may             
 have their licenses revoked.  She noted the state will lose $38               
 million in federal funds if, by October, a statute is not in place            
 that requires the expulsion of a student for a minimum of one year            
 for bringing guns on to school grounds.  HB 28, sponsored by                  
 Representative Bunde, attempts to do that.  The question of what to           
 do with students that have been expelled needs to be addressed.  HB
 28 would also raise the level of the offense from a class B                   
 misdemeanor to a class A misdemeanor.  Under existing law, the                
 ability to petition for waiver of a juvenile exists, at any age,              
 when unamenability to treatment can be shown.  It is not automatic,           
 but if the juvenile has committed a second offense, that argument             
 is feasible.  For those reasons, Ms. Knuth asked the committee to             
 hold the bill.                                                                
                                                                               
 Number 450                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR ADAMS asked what the state's plan is for continuing the               
 education of a student who has been expelled from school.  MS.                
 KNUTH replied that issue is currently being discussed.                        
                                                                               
 SENATOR TAYLOR commented SB 26 does not provide for expulsion.                
                                                                               
 Number 458                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR ELLIS asked if SB 26 were to become law, a 14 yr. old, who            
 brought a gun to school for the second time, would be waived into             
 adult court.  He also asked where the sentence would be served.               
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH responded the juvenile could not serve the sentence in              
 the same institution as an adult due to federal prohibitions.  She            
 was not sure whether juveniles would serve the sentence at                    
 McLaughlin or whether special wings exist in adult prisons.                   
                                                                               
 SENATOR ELLIS noted McLaughlin is full, therefore they would most             
 likely be at overcrowded adult facilities but segregated from the             
 adult population.  MS. KNUTH agreed.                                          
                                                                               
 SENATOR TAYLOR added a judge could also fine the offender and take            
 money from the individual's permanent fund dividend check, or                 
 assign community work.                                                        
                                                                               
 Number 472                                                                    
                                                                               
 KATHY TIBBLES, Director of the Division of Family and Youth                   
 Services, testified in opposition to SB 26 primarily because of the           
 age range covered in the measure.  She stated there are adolescents           
 who are increasingly difficult to deal with, but at age 14 the                
 opportunity to turn some juveniles around still exists.  Existing             
 statutes allow juveniles to be waived to adult court for heinous              
 crimes which serves the purpose better than an automatic waiver,              
 particularly for children as young as 14.                                     
                                                                               
 Number 482                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR TAYLOR stated no 14 year old would ever be impacted by SB
 26 unless they had, at 13, committed the same offense.   He                   
 commented the bill only applies to recidivists.  MS. TIBBLES                  
 replied it is possible that an adolescent could be charged and                
 adjudicated at 13 or 14 years of age for taking a weapon to school,           
 or for shooting a stop sign.  The second offense could be more                
 serious, perhaps a felony offense.  She added the federal law                 
 prohibiting transfer of a juvenile to an adult court starts at age            
 16.  She thought it was possible that a 14 year old could end up in           
 an adult jail as a result of a conviction in adult court if waived.           
 She believed that would preclude any second chance available to try           
 to turn the adolescent around.                                                
                                                                               
 Number 499                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR GREEN asked if a judge would be precluded at that point               
 from alternate sentencing. SENATOR TAYLOR responded no judge in the           
 state would be so naive to think he/she could place a 14 year old             
 into an adult facility.                                                       
                                                                               
 Number 504                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR DONLEY noted the administration recently supported a bill             
 in the Finance Committee that required a child of any age to go to            
 adult court for stealing a motor vehicle, for a first offense.  He            
 reiterated a second time firearm offender is a greater public                 
 safety threat than a person who commits a joyriding offense.  He              
 felt the administration's position to be inconsistent.                        
                                                                               
 Number 522                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR GREEN suggested combining SB 26 with the "use it, lose it"            
 bill and Representative Bunde's bill.                                         
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER moved SB 26 out of committee with individual                   
 recommendations.  There being no objection, the motion carried.               

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